Should Delaware teachers be permitted to carry concealed weapons with proper permits and special training?

All the gun control laws in the world won’t stop a determined person.

I for one feel teachers and school administrators should be permitted to carry concealed weapons (handguns) with proper permits and specialized training.

This is a first class F’ing joke, Bulletproof whiteboard shields placed in school Matthew Albright, The News Journal. This board only protects the torso and the person (teacher holding it). Delaware has some good action plans as part of policy such as lock-downs. However, we need to get serious and have an offensive plan of action. 

Guns In Schools: Firearms Already Allowed In 18 States … Huffington Post. The time for Delaware to permit the same is now.

Publius being the teacher’s pet you go first! 

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23 responses to “Should Delaware teachers be permitted to carry concealed weapons with proper permits and special training?

  1. Yes, but only if Arne Duncun is visiting their school.

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  2. Josiah Andrews

    It is an excellent idea. In all honesty, how in the hell is a teacher supposed to protect a kid if they can’t even protect themselves?

    If the teacher wants to carry and they have the proper permit and training, then they should be allowed to carry.

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  3. Josiah Andrews

    The News Journal just issued a warning that Philadelphia area Universities are under a warning for a threat. Are we just going to wait until someone comes into a Delaware school before we allow teachers to arm themselves?

    Teachers are responsible for so much more than just teaching the standards. As parents, we expect teachers to protect our children. Arm them so that they can do that.

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  4. Bullshit. The chances of any given school or classroom actually being attacked are exceptionally low. On the other hand, with multiple firearms in the holsters or on the desks of supposedly “trained” teachers and administrators working in often highly charged atmospheres (especially in middle schools and high schools) the opportunity in just Delaware’s 350+ schools is enormous for (a) a teacher to pull a weapon in fear of his/her students; (b) a student to grab a weapon in a scuffle or a fight; (c) the chances for a suicidal teen to think about stealing the teacher’s weapon; (d) the chances for two teachers whose outside relationship has gone horribly bad squaring off; (e) a curious elementary schooler taking the opportunity to check out the teacher’s weapon …

    We have teachers in this state who have duct-taped special needs students to their desks, and you want to start handing out firearms?

    Nothing says to an inner-city kid security and warmth and a proper educational environment like leaving behind the gun-heavy Wilmington streets for a teacher with a .38 in her holster writing math problems on the board.

    Here’s a thought: instead of arming amateurs and waiting around for the everyday disasters that will inevitably happen, let’s take a little Rodel funding and restore actual police officers (SROs) in the schools.

    And, by the way, I’m a strong 2nd Amendment advocate, but this is simply a fucking ridiculous idea.

    Liked by 3 people

  5. What Steve said.

    Liked by 1 person

  6. God no. I know a LOT of teachers and they aren’t the most stable group. How about reducing the BS costs and going back to the full time SRO

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  7. Parents want school safety and they are right to demand it. Staff and students alike should not be in danger of delinquency and criminal behavior. Teachers with guns shouldn’t be necessary but if a teacher has a concealed carry permit (which requires quite a bit of training and background checks) then there should be no problem allowing them to carry their concealed firearm. I don’t see any push to “force” teachers to arm themselves so I’m not sure how Steve’s comment is quite accurate. If they are armed, it should be concealed. Preventing inappropriate students/ individuals access into the building, and requiring secure entry / exits will be far more effective.

    I also don’t think schools should have to be police officer patrolled. Secure entry/ exit points and restrict behaviorally deficient children from entering the building (creating the highly charged atmosphere in the first place) would be safer and more cost effective than posting armed guards in the hallways (police trained or not). Maybe instead of accommodating Jea Street’s idea of selective rule enforcement, we could allow school staff to keep the environment focused on education instead of behavioral modification and crisis counseling.
    http://nypost.com/2015/10/04/charter-schools-suspend-kids-public-schools-dont-which-does-better/

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  8. OK M Ryder–let’s take this seriatem

    1–I demand safety for my kids in school (right now I am raising a grandson who is in seventh grade) BUT I think the odds are that he will be at a greater danger from an unknown number of armed teachers than he will be from the random chance that his school is selected by a nutcase.

    2–The “training” for a CCW has literally NOTHING to do with the training necessary for me to trust a teacher or an administrator to conceal carry inside a school. I know: I have been through CCW training. I have also been involved in training MPs in appropriate weapons use policy in confrontational situations. The two types of training have nothing to do with each other.

    3–I note that you do NOT address the issue of all the ways this could go horribly wrong–a CCW teacher breaking up a fight gets the weapon pulled from his/her holster (it happens to police every day, who are far better trained and usually in better physical condition) … We have plenty PLENTY of evidence of the incredibly bad judgment that a small percentage of teachers are capable of falling prey to–none of that impinges their ability to acquire a CCW

    4–SROs have actually worked quite well in Delaware. Many upstate school districts, when the GA cut their funding, dug into local funds to at least cover the high schools and middle schools. They don’t “patrol” the halls, but if they did I would have far less trouble with that than random teachers possibly being armed. I will even spot you the “armed teacher stops mass murderer” scenario occurring, and still be willing to bet that over a 10-year period more people would be shot by their own teachers and administrators (or students would get hold of the guns) than would fall prey to mass murderers.

    5–You flunk reading comprehension unless you can cite a phrase in my original comment that suggests I believe teachers would be “forced” to be armed. Never said that or suggested it. But I am not willing to bet student lives on the appropriateness of CCW training for people handling highly emotionally charged situations every single day to be more effective in deterring problems than in causing them.

    6–and finally–I would seriously doubt DSEA would support this idea, from a liability standpoint alone, and because the organization has never floated it. The majority of teachers, I would be willing to bet, do not want to work in a school where an unknown number of their colleagues are concealed carrying.

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    • How many more responsibilities are we going to place on our school employees?

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    • Steve,
      I am trying to recall the number of mass shootings by teachers and can’t recall too many. Be advised, I wasn’t advocating CCW teachers, merely pointing out that with the level of violence and behavioral problems in schools today, it might be beneficial to have an unknown (concealed carrying teachers) to give pause or counter balance to those who would come into schools with the belief they are “soft” targets. Why do you think the violence has occurred in schools or theaters? They are not particularly secure. The OR shooter and other evil perps didn’t enter secure buildings, they entered relatively unrestricted, insecure facilities. Could things go wrong with CCW staff, yes. No argument. Are all our schools secure, no. Sorry for the disagreement but if a teenage student were to attack or assault a CCW teacher, resulting in a student being shot, I’d call that the consequence of allowing violent or maladjusted students in the door. Again, I’m not advocating students be shot. Furthest from it. Merely pointing out that most responsible people such as college educated teaching professionals with CCW will not be brandishing the weapon. Your “belief” that there will be more student shootings is a bit biased. It is no better than my belief that CCW teachers would reduce violence in school. Neither can be proved but human nature tends to dictate that even unruly / juvenile delinquents make a win/ loss assessment of situations. Fear of a possibly armed teacher could be beneficial in a dangerous classroom or with the students who might consider coming to school armed. (Harris & Klebold-Columbine)

      SRO’s – Why should we have to have police in schools? Is that reasonable? Why should our police force and the expense of their presence be a requirement for schools when simply preventing unauthorized access would stop most acts? I am not opposed to keeping our kids secure but I’m having a problem with saying we need an armed police/ security force which is very expensive in schools.

      My loose interpretation of forcing teachers to be armed was from this statement: “arming amateurs and waiting around”. You never said it was forced but the impression is that teachers would be forced by some entity be armed. Steve, I’m not trying to raise your temperature gauge just commenting on a different point of view.

      “The majority of teachers, I would be willing to bet, do not want to work in a school where an unknown number of their colleagues are concealed carrying.” -I would think or bet that a majority of teachers don’t want to work in an environment where they are in danger of being assaulted or intruders are allowed easy access. If I am a teacher in a dangerous school or any school really, and Mr Smith in room 102, next door has a CCW, I personally would feel safer, not more in danger.

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  9. I look at it this way. If you want a teacher to be a security office, and a teacher, pay him/her to be a security officer and a teacher. Otherwise, let him/her do his/her job as a teacher, and pay someone else to be a security officer. It’s absurd what some in the public want teachers to do.

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  10. Exactly. The list of responsibilities, outside of teaching, that a teacher does on a daily basis is ever growing. The last thing that needs to be added to the list of responsibilities is that of a security officer. If one is necessary, provide for the properly trained individual to perform the duty. I can’t imagine working in a classroom where a gun is present. It is absolutely the worst idea I’ve ever heard. If you need an RO in every hallway (which I don’t think we do), then put an RO in every hallway.

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    • Sorry but a militarized school with guards in every hallway doesn’t sound like a reasonable or sustained response. No doubt, some schools in violent areas are this way but a police officer or armed guard in every hallway does not bode well for a “relaxed” and “open” educational experience.

      Reiterating again to make clear, I am not advocating for teachers to all go out and get CCW permits. That is NOT my point. My point is only that if a background checked (as all teachers are already supposed to have background checks to work with children), trained permit holder wants to carry a concealed weapon, then in certain circumstances that “might” be helpful to stem violence in certain situations. That’s a lot of “might’s”, “maybe’s” and “certain situations”, NOT: every teacher, in every school. Teachers should not be afraid in their classrooms. Kids shouldn’t be afraid of all the guards in the hallways. That isn’t a school.

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  11. Josiah Andrews

    snewton929 is a FUCKTARD.

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    • Publius e decere

      I can see that public schooling has tremendously helped your ability to dissect and debate issues. Steve laid out a working hypothesis. Responding with a personal attack is hardly helpful. Steve – 1. Josiah – 0

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  12. Josiah Andrews

    Concealed carry means that no one sees it. Snewton must be one of the the dumbest motherfuckers on this thread.

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    • kilroysdelaware

      Josiah please chill on the profanity attacks against others! Please!

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    • Josiah, I have to agree with Steve on this one. You know I respect you, but the inherent dangers of allowing teachers to have a gun is very dangerous. The odds of a Columbine or Newtown are very rare in the grand scheme of things. Give teachers guns, whether they are concealed or not, makes the odds of more events happening increase exponentially. Steve is a good guy and he does know what he’s talking about.

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  13. Josiah–leaving aside your devastating wit–if CCW is allowed for teachers it means that people know there are weapons in the school even if they do not know who exactly carries them. In a school it will hardly remain a secret for long, if only because (a) teachers will inevitably talk about it; and (b) many parents will demand to know if their child’s teachers are heeled. And the school WILL have to answer them, especially in a choice-driven environment. If you don’t get that, dear eloquent Josiah, then the “tard” label belongs to you.

    Secondly, instead of cursing me out, if you want to be effective you might try actually dealing with the arguments–or you might have tried that if you had the slightest idea of what you were talking about.

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